SuzukiHayabusa.org
GENERAL => MAXIMUM OVERDRIVE => Topic started by: Daveeed on March 28, 2018, 02:51:58 PM
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Having worn through several sets of Web cams, and repaired the damage... I'm getting tired of it.
And please don't think I'm dissing Web, that is not my intent. I will happily purchase more Web cams if I decide to go that route.
I want the HP that Web 425/415 and or Web 445/415 provide, however I'm wondering what cam manufacturers, friction reducing coatings, or other viable options should be considered that may provide longer life when running high lift cams?
Good to be back!
Daveeed
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PM'd
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Don't ride on the street with them.
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I`ve also experienced few pairs of Webcams wearing out, but they all been hardwelds and the guy who been repairing them for me says the difference in the filling material makes the wear. I dont know if billetts would be better.
Regrind from stock ones are very durable, but there are limited options , no big cams possible.
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Any chance you are getting into valve float? Very hard on the cams when they come back into contact. I understand Web tends to use fairly aggressive ramps (not saying it's good or bad - just part of the overall package).
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What Steve said-- Dave did indeed ride at least one set of cams on the street a bunch, not sure of others?? And send me your PM as well, Mike.
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Thanks Guys!
I called Web Cams and what I'm going to do is send the cams back to Web and have them repaired. (I didn't know they did repair)
Melessa at Web said if almost all the lobes are bad then its best to get new cams. If only a couple lobes then its best to repair.
I can't wait to get this beast running, Its gonna run so freakn good!
Smokey burnout,
Daveeed
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I have seen a pile of web cams fail. I feel like the soft plugs in the end need knocked out and have them cleaned very well and replace. I have seen lobes wear off as well as cam journals damages
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How much street riding is too much ?
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How much street riding is too much ?
It depends where and how you ride. On the Autobahn you probably will have no problems, but stuck in traffic on a hot summer day with the bike idling you are almost guaranteed to wear the cams. At low speed and low RPM's the lobe spends more time against the bucket follower. Oil pressure is also less so there is less oil getting to the interface. If an exhaust pipe required removal of the oil cooler that doesn't help. All this assumes you are using stronger springs to support the higher rev potential of the performance cams. LSL
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Where on the cam lobe are you seeing the wear? On the nose? Or on the closing ramp? Or the entire lobe?
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For me, cam lobe wear starts about 1/8" from the nose, across the nose, and then down the closing ramp no more than 1/4 inch. I have noticed on most of the lobes that have cracking and flaking on the sides, also have the bad lobe, leading me to believe as crap flakes off the side-o-the-lobe, it ends up on the bucket, and kills the lobe. This was on a set of 425/415 cams. I was running 65 lb springs, which I understand should be 55 lb springs if I was to run this cam/spring combo on the street... but I didn't know.
I put about 2,000 street miles (on the bike) on the bike, and almost all the intake and exhaust lobes were gone. After the bike broke a valve off at Mojave, I measured the clearances... one of my cam to bucket clearances was >.100".
The bike dynoed at 225 hp when fresh on fireman Jim's dyno, and then year or so later we dynoed the weekend before Mojave and the bike dynoed at 220 hp. I thought the cause of dropping 5 hp was because on monsoon rain coming down while we were on the dyno. I remember sitting on the bike (with it running) and me saying WTF?, this thing is Fing clattering bad! Lessons learned.
The next set of cams are 445 / 415 which came off a busa that ran on the salt a couple years in a row, it must have had very low miles on it. The exhaust cam is fine, however the intake has both #1 lobes degraded just a bit, but enough for me not to run them after dumping yet another couple thousand into the motor. I am sending the cams to Web for repair.
I'm thinking from now on I will not start a high lift motor that has sat around during the winter without putting some KY jelly on the lobes/buckets.
So what the hell, Smokey burnout !
Daveeed
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What oil are you running?
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Running Mobil 1 oil.
DD
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You said it 2k on the street. They will start to wear at 1k.
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My friend is (was) optimistic, he has 1622cc gen2 n/a, and he wants to ride it on the street , when not running the mile. Mile speeds are under and over 220mph, power around 265bhp.
Last summer he decided to ride it to this mile event, 1500 miles away, engine broke 2 miles before arriving to the track, one intake was worn, spring in pieces and valves hitting piston. He got 3700mls on the clock with that setup before it broke.
There was wide lobe billet camshaft, oil was not the best grade.
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lots of my stuff I send off for nitrating then cryo/superfinish. Works good last long time. But first find out why, that issue is not common. Early BMW S1000rr had an issue of improperly hardened cams leading to failures.
I have a set of those same cams for sale. I could have them preped for you, nitride, cryo, and superfinish it is pricey, but so is a damaged engine...
Having worn through several sets of Web cams, and repaired the damage... I'm getting tired of it.
And please don't think I'm dissing Web, that is not my intent. I will happily purchase more Web cams if I decide to go that route.
I want the HP that Web 425/415 and or Web 445/415 provide, however I'm wondering what cam manufacturers, friction reducing coatings, or other viable options should be considered that may provide longer life when running high lift cams?
Good to be back!
Daveeed