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Author Topic: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?  (Read 26045 times)

Offline halvefast

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #25 on: March 11, 2008, 10:22:05 PM »
That same $400 will get better results invested in a dry kit  :?

JMHO

That's how I did it, 770lbs bike & rider 225rwhp
so if you are lighter it won't take so much.

Hope that helps with your decision
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Offline gazza414

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #26 on: March 12, 2008, 12:45:39 AM »
you might find that the seals "absorb" alota energy.

50 shot of NOS will get you into the club
« Last Edit: March 12, 2008, 12:47:24 AM by gazza414 »
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Offline hawkwind

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #27 on: March 12, 2008, 04:24:20 AM »
You could try a set of" universe wide bearings",there   rare earth super magnetic bearings with the patented tri-lithium friction modifier are good for at least another 100 mph and only at 1.2K a set , gee's all the sponsered racers are saying there the ducks guts so it must be true  :wink:, a 50 shot of nitrous will do the trick at a reasonably low cost ,I know because thats how I did it and Im meaner than scrooge
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Offline Blue

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #28 on: March 12, 2008, 07:15:00 AM »
Right, so if the bearings are producing 3Kw of heat, why does the grease not all run out?

Bearing grease is thick and the bearings are sealed.

Offline Pete

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #29 on: March 13, 2008, 04:42:52 PM »
Stock bearings are only sealed one side aren't they?

In any case I think that just taking out old steel bearings and fitting new steel ones would see a reduction in resistance so that claim carries little weight with me. I would certainly want to be seeing some concrete proof before spending $400 on wheel bearings. I don't mean "Joe Schmoe uses them and he's been light speed" I'm talking proper measured or calculated figures from laborotory-condition testing. If there is such data about (and surely there should be), let someone post it up here.

I mean, I've seen proper test certs for 100-dollar head bolts on here because people doubted their performance yet folks are quite happy to shell-out many times that on bearings with dubious or un-proven claims attached to them.

Offline Blue

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #30 on: March 14, 2008, 07:25:02 AM »
OK, I'll say this one more time:  high end ceramic bearings (yes, they are $400) frees up four hp on a 'busa.  That is documented from back to back dyno runs at a reputable local tuner; this is not Joe Blow speculation.

Choose to believe or not.  $100/hp is not a terrible deal, it's about what you get from a pipe and dyno tune.

Personally, I wouldn't do the mod, it is a little pricey for bearings, but I would do it as a replacement.

Blue

Offline Pete

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #31 on: March 14, 2008, 09:11:27 AM »
Fine - so where's the data and testing conditions?

Offline Mospeada

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #32 on: March 14, 2008, 12:10:04 PM »
Blue may, or may not, still have that info.

But feel free to ask every MotoGP, AMA, NHRA drag bike, WSB, or other teams info on why they all use it. Don't forget all the LSR guys that have records, excpet for Gazza, which he may be the only guy that I know of to go fast with out 'em. Of course, that does make me wonder how much faster he can go with them. But that's just me. Break 220, perhaps?
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Offline DaveO

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #33 on: March 14, 2008, 12:30:31 PM »
Without stick my neck out too far.....

Garry and Geri you seem quite skeptical about the ceramics......from what I can see.

What I can tell you from experience/testing......

1)  I could not measure any difference on the dyno.

2) The rolling resistance is reduced....if you spin my front wheel with no calipers on it will continue to rotate for MINUTES...My stock ones did not.....

3) My bike did set the NA world record 2 years ago with them......I cant tell you if it would have WITHOUT....

They are one of those upgrades that is "the sum of parts is more than" in my book...i.e. like coatings etc on hard parts....

FWIW MY OPINION...If you have exhausted most resources to improve your bikes performance....pipe/mappin/etc....AND you want EVERYTHING YOU CAN GET FROM YOUR MACHINE, Then I recommend them to those who can afford. I truly believe they help...esp when installed/lubed correctly.....

But that is only MY OPINION......They may not be worth it for the average Joe.....

Besides they dont work "down under" since things rotate backwards down there...LOL

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Offline Pete

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2008, 02:09:09 PM »
As always the voice of reason Dave :thumb:

I'm not sceptical about their ability to reduce rolling resistance, far from it in fact and like you I would accept my own observations as evidence should I install them, spin the wheel and observe it spinning for longer.

What I am sceptical of is the use of dyno data to prove an equivalent of 4hp (or any other hp) gain by reduced rolling resistance in the bearings. There are far too many variables involved (atmospherics, engine coolant temps, chain tension, strap-down tension, axle-bolt torque, rear-wheel alignment etc etc etc) for me to accept that as "proof). These bearings weren't produced by someone baking china clay in a fire-pit, they must have been scientifically researched, thoroughly tested, data collected and compared to similar products etc. This is the data I'm calling for. It's not an unreasonable request, they sell the things at a heck of a price, I'd want proper researched and measured performance data before committing my money to them.

Offline fvance

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #35 on: March 14, 2008, 03:11:28 PM »
Ok Im going to put my 2cents worth in. If I was just going to ride my bike on the street I probably wouldn't use them. but Im building a production Bonneville bike,running on a 201+ record, if these bearings can get me 2-4mph for 400 bucks Ill try it. From everything I have read Im going to use them. O yeah Im going to use the engine set also.
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Offline hawkwind

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #36 on: March 14, 2008, 04:12:17 PM »
Agreed that as a last resort to finding that extra poofteenth of speed , agreed that they will reduce the rolling resistance friction in the wheel bearings  but most of your rolling resistance comes from hysterisis (sp) deformation of the rubber tyre and that at the speeds we are discussing total rolling resistance is a minor player in total drag , opinion still stands ,spend that 400 toward a nitrous system for maximum bang for buck and do 200+ ,or if you are chasing the gas record spend it on a set of hi comp pistons
cheers
« Last Edit: March 14, 2008, 04:16:32 PM by hawkwind »
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Offline FJman

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #37 on: March 15, 2008, 01:38:10 PM »
The pro's use ceramic bearings.  However, they're also spending thousands and thousands of dollars.  The question isn't "do they work," the question is "do they work better than other things you could spend $400 on when you're on a $1k budget.

Reducing friction in the bearings means less heat generated (yes, that's what happens to wasted energy, almost always it's turned into heat).  The gains will be progressively better the faster the bearing is spinning, so 4hp at what speed is the real question. 

Reducing rotating mass (i.e., super light wheels, lightened rotors, etc) tends to show the best gains in rate of change situations--better braking, better accelleration.  Same with lightening non-rotating parts (carbon bodywork, aluminium subframe, and so on), but for top speed where you've got a good bit of room to work with not so much, as the problem is generally drag from wind.  Anything to give yourself a smaller head-on area will be helpful, such as lowering, removing mirrors, that sort of thing, (good body position!).

Running a little extra air pressure in the tires will help reduce deformation of the tire, making it take longer to get up to temp (becuase less engergy is being spent on flexing the tire).  Think about pushing a bike around with a flat tire, and how much work it is, the same is true in the other direction.  Also a little more air presents a smaller contact patch to the ground, again because the tire is unable to flex as much and is basically a round profile at the ground.

Sounds like a fun project, gluck!

Offline Blue

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #38 on: March 16, 2008, 08:29:26 PM »
Blue may, or may not, still have that info.

But feel free to ask every MotoGP, AMA, NHRA drag bike, WSB, or other teams info on why they all use it. Don't forget all the LSR guys that have records, excpet for Gazza, which he may be the only guy that I know of to go fast with out 'em. Of course, that does make me wonder how much faster he can go with them. But that's just me. Break 220, perhaps?

don't get me wrong 4 hp is a huge increase for a race team, it's free hp in the fact that most increases, especially at a comptetive state of tune, involve some reduction in durability; exotic bearings like this actually reduce the load on everything but the tires.

sorry if I misstated what I was trying to say. :D

Blue

Offline eevultwinn

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2008, 01:02:40 AM »
Okay, drag, as we all should know... when chasing speed records... is proportional to the square of the speed. That means... you quadruple the drag or lift when you double the speed. For those slower in mathematics... at 100 mph drag is FOUR times what it is at 50 miles per hour. (There ARE other variables involed, but for the most part this is true to the best knowledge of physics)
     To do 200 mph, you have to overcome FOUR TIMES THE DRAG THAT IS OR WOULD BE PRODUCED AT 100 mph. If you think about it... that is a MONUMENTAL task. It can be done, but to do it with under $1000 out of pocket is a stretch. If it IS possible... you need to post it in your PERSONAL business literature and sell the neccesary modifications to ALL willing to spend the money. Possibly the easiest money on the planet. Try to keep it simple and secret. "I" think... spend your money on quality engine mods and PROPER tuning on a dyno... (by someone TRULY QUALIFIED)... and BELIEVE in what you are trying to do. Making record breaking horsepower is a COSTLY undertaking and you SHOULD remember that when those people are telling you that they CAN give it to you for UNDER $1000. Good luck and let EVERYBODY know when you figure it out. I myself would LOOOOOVE to see the other side of the "special" number. Kudos for giving it a REAL effort.

Offline showtime912

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #40 on: June 05, 2008, 01:58:57 AM »
Or...you can just get your speedo to lie.   :)

Offline canyon carver

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #41 on: June 05, 2008, 08:05:07 PM »
Your Busa can get to 200mph WITHOUT any of the modifications listed above. Thats right boys and girls, you heard it here first. All you need is (drum roll.......) a speedo healer. When I got mine I adjusted it a little too much and low and behold I was pegging the spedo on an LA freeway. The cars were a blur...........as they went by me.
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Offline 06 Red+Black

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #42 on: July 19, 2008, 11:19:51 PM »
Get a used NOS kit there cheap and then just hit it when you get to 6th. Should push you to the magical 200.  Ran a zex on my bike for awhile almost half a second 1/8th mile times but it was just a dry kit and not enough power for what I wanted.

Offline jimmyt1222

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #43 on: July 22, 2008, 08:58:31 PM »
I think drag is a major obstacle for you to over come. So here is what you need to do: Remove your gear, no pants, no jacket, no shirt, no helmet, no right shoe (your gonna want the left one for shifting). Next, grab a large can of crisco. Rub that magical lube all over your body, cover your arms, legs and head very well. I actually did this once and it really works, but man is it a bitch to get that crisco out of your hair.
But seriously, I'm not sure I believe it's possible for under $1000. However I would love to find out otherwise. Good luck.

Offline warezdog

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #44 on: January 25, 2009, 08:16:40 PM »
Didnt make the october run do to taking a new job in DC but making plans now to hit the one in March. Tearing the bike down in the next week in order to get it dyno'd before the drive down. If I still have money left is the zex the best nitro shot for the money?
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Offline corderpounder88

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #45 on: March 01, 2009, 01:39:06 AM »
well i am sure you guys will think i am lieing i have an 03 lowered with busted gauges ie. the speedo dont work so i decided to use my gps and i have had mine on the gps over 200 only mods i have done is that i have no mirrors lowered it and have a double bubble windscreen. so whats the deal.

Offline Got-Busa?

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #46 on: March 02, 2009, 12:09:27 AM »
I've got a similar thread going for the Gen-II, see the link in my sig for info.  I should have the pipe and remaining goodies this week for the install and results at the end of March. :thumb:
CLICK-->  *Got-Busa's "STREET BIKE"-project* <--CLICK
"WILMINGTON MILE" - 212.7 MPH!
"ARKANSAS 1/2 MILE" - 202.566 MPH!
"ARKANSAS 2KM" 232.919 MPH!
THANK YOU SHANE STUBBS @ STPI
"TEXAS MILE" -182.265 MPH stock --204.468 MPH "Brock's Performance" basic mods -- 227.2 MPH "RCC TURBO" low boost/half naked!

Offline Mospeada

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #47 on: March 02, 2009, 12:32:04 AM »
well i am sure you guys will think i am lieing i have an 03 lowered with busted gauges ie. the speedo dont work so i decided to use my gps and i have had mine on the gps over 200 only mods i have done is that i have no mirrors lowered it and have a double bubble windscreen. so whats the deal.

Unfortunately, your GPS doesn't work. First, you need a TRE to pass 186 mph. 2nd, you need a LOT of mods to get that number, and your avatar looks like it's showing a bike with a stock exhaust. I don't know what to tell you, but a stock Busa won't touch 200. Best case scenario, with a TRE and a well broken in bike, oil change/clean chain/tune-up/etc...BEST case maybe 194, the most I ever heard of a stock bike.
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Offline Cookie

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #48 on: March 02, 2009, 12:32:58 AM »
You could hit the 200 marque with a stock Hayabusa with no mods,,, with only the fine choice additions of Lowered Hugemanboobs Slip-ons and his tubes to nowhere!  :lol:
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Offline Got-Busa?

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Re: 200 mph on a stock busa with cheap mods under $1000?
« Reply #49 on: March 02, 2009, 12:37:30 AM »
I figured he dropped it out of a plane to get that speed... :lol:
CLICK-->  *Got-Busa's "STREET BIKE"-project* <--CLICK
"WILMINGTON MILE" - 212.7 MPH!
"ARKANSAS 1/2 MILE" - 202.566 MPH!
"ARKANSAS 2KM" 232.919 MPH!
THANK YOU SHANE STUBBS @ STPI
"TEXAS MILE" -182.265 MPH stock --204.468 MPH "Brock's Performance" basic mods -- 227.2 MPH "RCC TURBO" low boost/half naked!