200-MPH Club Member What Is The Next Logical Step?

[JR Killiany]

At Bonneville the next step above the 200-MPH club is the 300-MPH club.  Now that is a big step.

How about going from zero to 200-MPH within 1-mile two-up or double.

Men: get your favorite girl (a 110-pounder would be nice) and ask her if she would like to go for a ride.  A fast ride. Don't forget to tell her to hang on tight.

Women: if you have a big guy, you better get him on a diet. Jen do you think you can get your dad (Roger) to ride on the back.

Another first, father daughter 200-MPH club member two-up.

Just a thought.

JR Killiany

[brmrc51]

 :thumb:will be good for traction, but good luck finding a dame for the run!!!

[jgennaro]

Good luck finding a track that would take on the responsibility/accountability of a 2 up land speed run!  Then again...........you could just find a long straight away and use a GPS!

Jason

[TrickTom1]

My wife won't even ride with me on the street anymore doing the speed limit.

[brmrc51]

amem to that. they know a twist of the wrist is alot cheaper than a divorice !

[JR Killiany]

I captured this article from www.bmwsuperbikes.com.

Woodcliff Lake, NJ - November 8, 2005... A 2006 production model BMW K 1200 S has set a world land speed record in the 1000 - 1350 cc stock, partially streamlined, naturally aspirated motorcycle class at Utah's famed Bonneville Salt Flats. The motorcycle, piloted by 56-year-old Andy Sills, of San Francisco, CA, reached an average speed of 173.57 mph and top speed of 176.789 mph after two runs on the vast, white plains, where hundreds of land speed records have been set and broken since the early 1900s in a variety of automobile and motorcycle classes.

"It was a rare opportunity for me and BMW," commented Sills, an avid BMW enthusiast, who, collectively, has amassed more than 300,000 miles on four BMW motorcycles within the last seven years. Sills went on to say, "The best part is that our record on the stock BMW K 1200 S matched to the mile, the historic last record run of 173.68 mph by Ernst Henne on a specially equipped streamlined BMW! He must have been watching over us."

Sills, who began making his mark on the Bonneville Salt Flats four years ago and who holds the world 80cc and 100cc motorcycle streamliner records, also clocked a record speed of 169 mph, riding the K 1200 S two-up with passenger Erin Hunter. The pair received a standing ovation from a cheering crowd of fellow competitors as they made their way into the pits.

The records, which were ratified on October 25, 2005, were set September 8, 2005 according to rules set forth by the Federation Internationale de Motocyclisme (FIM), the century-old, Swiss-based governing body for five motorcycling disciplines (road racing, motocross, trial, enduro and track racing).

I would like to add separate from the above article the fact that the very next year the Suzuki Hayabusa competed in the same class and ran 198.??? mph.

JR Killiany

[jgennaro]

I captured this article from www.bmwsuperbikes.com.

Woodcliff Lake, NJ - November 8, 2005... A 2006 production model BMW K 1200 S has set a world land speed record in the 1000 - 1350 cc stock, partially streamlined, naturally aspirated motorcycle class at Utah's famed Bonneville Salt Flats. The motorcycle, piloted by 56-year-old Andy Sills, of San Francisco, CA, reached an average speed of 173.57 mph and top speed of 176.789 mph after two runs on the vast, white plains, where hundreds of land speed records have been set and broken since the early 1900s in a variety of automobile and motorcycle classes.

"It was a rare opportunity for me and BMW," commented Sills, an avid BMW enthusiast, who, collectively, has amassed more than 300,000 miles on four BMW motorcycles within the last seven years. Sills went on to say, "The best part is that our record on the stock BMW K 1200 S matched to the mile, the historic last record run of 173.68 mph by Ernst Henne on a specially equipped streamlined BMW! He must have been watching over us."

Sills, who began making his mark on the Bonneville Salt Flats four years ago and who holds the world 80cc and 100cc motorcycle streamliner records, also clocked a record speed of 169 mph, riding the K 1200 S two-up with passenger Erin Hunter. The pair received a standing ovation from a cheering crowd of fellow competitors as they made their way into the pits.

The records, which were ratified on October 25, 2005, were set September 8, 2005 according to rules set forth by the Federation Internationale de Motocyclisme (FIM), the century-old, Swiss-based governing body for five motorcycling disciplines (road racing, motocross, trial, enduro and track racing).

I would like to add separate from the above article the fact that the very next year the Suzuki Hayabusa competed in the same class and ran 198.??? mph.

JR Killiany

I wonder if Maxton or Texas would go for the two up thing?

Jason

[TRNorBRN6001]

Don't know if two TFA members would even fit on a bike without snapping it like a twig. Some
of us should be counted as two people any how!         

[SPEED KING]

After Andy and Erin ran the 160+ pass I petion-ed the race organizer to run two-up with my Turbo Busa and was later told a firm NO...I had, Erin, Andy and two others that said they would be my passenger and I told the promoter that we would only run just over 200 miles-per-hour...  oh well...

[DahMurf]

hmmmm, interesting. I didn't know you could go 2-up under FIM. I know you can run a passenger on a side car (is that at bub only?) but never thought of 2-up straight up.
hmmm I wonder if bub would allow 2-up?

As for Maxton, I seriously doubt it. You can't run a passenger in a 4 wheeler, I doubt they'd ever let a passenger on 2 wheels!

That being said, Todd & I have done somewhere around 150-160 2-up on my busa. Him driving of course. I would compete with him 2-up. We'd have
to do some alterations to the bike to support it. Like someplace for the passenger to hold onto other then/in addition to the driver. Holding on is the hardest
part!

Oh & just for the TFA crowd, our weight together is 300lbs.

Deb

[DahMurf]

So they would only let the 2-up run happend once? Which meet/sanctioning body allowed that? I know it said FIM did they have their own meet or was that during BUB or USFRA... ?

Deb

[jgennaro]

hmmmm, interesting. I didn't know you could go 2-up under FIM. I know you can run a passenger on a side car (is that at bub only?) but never thought of 2-up straight up.
hmmm I wonder if bub would allow 2-up?

As for Maxton, I seriously doubt it. You can't run a passenger in a 4 wheeler, I doubt they'd ever let a passenger on 2 wheels!

That being said, Todd & I have done somewhere around 150-160 2-up on my busa. Him driving of course. I would compete with him 2-up. We'd have
to do some alterations to the bike to support it. Like someplace for the passenger to hold onto other then/in addition to the driver. Holding on is the hardest
part!

Oh & just for the TFA crowd, our weight together is 300lbs.

Deb

I'm glad Todd was driving.  A man shouldn't have to ride "bitch."  It's way too embarrassing!

Jason

[SPEED KING]

hmmmm, interesting. I didn't know you could go 2-up under FIM. I know you can run a passenger on a side car (is that at bub only?) but never thought of 2-up straight up.
hmmm I wonder if bub would allow 2-up?

As for Maxton, I seriously doubt it. You can't run a passenger in a 4 wheeler, I doubt they'd ever let a passenger on 2 wheels!

That being said, Todd & I have done somewhere around 150-160 2-up on my busa. Him driving of course. I would compete with him 2-up. We'd have
to do some alterations to the bike to support it. Like someplace for the passenger to hold onto other then/in addition to the driver. Holding on is the hardest
part!

Oh & just for the TFA crowd, our weight together is 300lbs.

Deb

Deb,

It was during the 2005 FIM/Bubs meet at Bonneville...after the run was when I mentioned I would like to run over 200 with a passenger and before I asked I made sure we had severl people that would go for it as the passenger.

When we asked Denis Manning said no so we ended up not running a passeger however this year we may have a person on a three wheeler...shooting for a slower speed of only 188mph or so...

So Todd is 175 and you are 125..?  (Don't hit me?



J

[DahMurf]

Deb,

It was during the 2005 FIM/Bubs meet at Bonneville...after the run was when I mentioned I would like to run over 200 with a passenger and before I asked I made sure we had severl people that would go for it as the passenger.

When we asked Denis Manning said no so we ended up not running a passeger however this year we may have a person on a three wheeler...shooting for a slower speed of only 188mph or so...

So Todd is 175 and you are 125..?  (Don't hit me?



J

By three wheeler do you mean a sidecar? I would think it's harder to hold on at higher speeds on the sidecar.
 
You're close. I typically weigh between 115-120 depending on how much I've been pigging out! Todd's not been hitting the gym lately! 

Jason, Todd's not allowed to ride bitch cause he picks the most distracting places to hold on! 

Deb

[jasontmc]

250mph club. no meetings no dues and only a handfull of members

[SPEED KING]

250mph club. no meetings no dues and only a handfull of members

Jason,

First they have to get to the party and dance...then seek membership in the 250 club...

I nominate you for Prez this year..

[jasontmc]

Jason,

First they have to get to the party and dance...then seek membership in the 250 club...

I nominate you for Prez this year..
[/quote]


I do have some time on my hands! know what i mean!

[SPEED KING]

Jason,

First they have to get to the party and dance...then seek membership in the 250 club...

I nominate you for Prez this year..

I do have some time on my hands! know what i mean!
[/quote]

Lazy azz...

[SPEED KING]

BTW,

Learn to quote if you want to run for office...

[DahMurf]

Sheesh and don't you need to name it properly?
something like Open Wheel Motorcycle 250 MPH Club?

You can be the OWM 250's



Deb

[isiahstites]

Curious as to your guys thoughts as far as the danger is concerned with having the much weight that far back on the bike. Having added weight that far back would change the center of gravity of the bike further back and potentially moving it close to or behind the center of pressure. Please correct me if I am wrong, but this could or would cause a high speed wobble due to the rear of the bike wanting to come around to front. I keep thinking about how a dart works, heavy in the front light in the rear.

I have seen the Andy Sills video of him riding two-up on his pass at the BuB event and the bike was a K1200S. That bike in my opinion is not a lightweight bike nor is the Busa, so while these two bikes may be able to get away with two-up high speed passes I doubt some of the smaller bikes could as the speeds increase...........your thoughts???


Scott

[isiahstites]

250mph club. no meetings no dues and only a handfull of members

I like this idea.......will you be passing out hats and shirts?

Scott

[DahMurf]

Scott, is that video available for viewing online? I know I'd love to see/study it & I bet I'm not the only one!

Don't know about the front end wobble but it definitely has the potential to change the CP/CG depending on how the riders are situated. Perhaps a setup like the cut rail stretched drag bikes might be a better catalyst for that type of riding.

Deb

[isiahstites]

Scott, is that video available for viewing online? I know I'd love to see/study it & I bet I'm not the only one!

Don't know about the front end wobble but it definitely has the potential to change the CP/CG depending on how the riders are situated. Perhaps a setup like the cut rail stretched drag bikes might be a better catalyst for that type of riding.

Deb

Deb - I can not find it anymore........as far a stretched drag bikes are concerned, it may be better but how many people do you think would build a race chassis for a bike to race two-up? I do not think to many as there are not a lot of people building custom racing chassis' in LSR now.

Scott

[DahMurf]

I think once the stock based records are saturated we're going to start seeing more & more complete builds.
(or should I say once John & Jason get done running up all of the records us mere mortals are going to be forced to build unique machines to chase their legacy!  )

Things like the opportunity to race 2-up for the chance at something new & unique, ie a new feather in ones cap, is just another opportunity.

I wonder if anyone has that video saved on their computer or on DVD. I'd really love to see it!

This has been an enlightening thread from a topic that I have to wonder if it wasn't started with sarcasm!
(of course they should know better with the true speedaholics around here! Some of us will try it any way we can!  )

Deb

[Racetrack14]

JR - sorta understand what your saying - at the Texas Mile all the emphasis is running 200MPH and once you accomplish that what do you do next. Naturally if you have the resources then you can keep building and go faster and faster. I wish the Texas Mile folks would get back to the vision they had in the beginning and add the races back with the season points championship. A four race winter series would be great with more emphasis on classes. You don't have to go 200 to have fun if class wins and records are recognized and documented.
Wayne Robertson is restoring his 100cc flat track bike to go after around 5 records at Maxton this fall with a record breaking speed of over 85MPH as the target. There would be no point for cousin Wayne to come to Texas and run because there would be no recognition for the record runs.

JR - you could run naked - I don't think anybody has done that and run 200 at the Texas Mile yet. That could be a first for Texas.

Racetrack

[DahMurf]

Y'all in TX might be good candidates for some speed clubs. We've talked about doing it at Maxton for some time. If you look at Guthrie's bikes he has speed stickers and I think Yancy has one on his bike as well. The idea was for incremental steps with a sticker for each. ie: 50 mph, 75mph, 100mph, 125mph, 150mph, 175mph, 200mph, 225mph, 250mph. There are so many different kinds of bikes that can run and each one has that golden ring of a speed where making one of these clubs is an extreme accomplishment. And for some, just for the rider to make the speed is an accomplishment regardless of bike.

Of course as usual you're going to need someone to run it, supply the stickers, track the recipients blah blah blah. But at least for TX where you don't have classes & records it would be something to shoot for!

Deb

[isiahstites]

(or should I say once John & Jason get done running up all of the records us mere mortals are going to be forced to build unique machines to chase their legacy!  )

Deb,

        This is why I am going to build a one off bike. I know on a stock Busa I will never be faster than those two and many others who have gone fast on stock chassis busa's. If I want to hang with them or beat them I am going to have to build on awesome machine to be competitive.

Scott

[hayaboosta]

I have seen VERY ill affects on the ability of a Busa to handle correctly with a few 25lbs bags of shot thrown under "the hump" or even under the tank.  I can imagine what a two up would do on shut down. 

I have been about the same speed as Deb and Todd two up (150ish) "back in the day" on my GS1150e hot rod.  If I gained alittle more weight I could weigh as much as Todd and Deb together, would that count?

[DahMurf]

Scott, we're looking forward to watching your build evolve!

If I gained alittle more weight I could weigh as much as Todd and Deb together, would that count?

Only if you put your junk in the trunk! 

I would imagine significantly increasing speeds two up would require some trial & error on the way up in regards to ride position to maintain the rider grip as well as bike stability. Although with a rider on back they do have the ability to shift their weight onto the foot pegs which will shift the weight lower then just sitting on the seat. You never know, having live ballast could be a good thing. The weight could be shifted to increase stability and traction!  You might want to hook up the rider to rider headsets and hope the heck you can hear at 200!  But actually that's why I would ride with Todd. We're very in tune with each others riding styles so we ride very well together be it two up or on two bikes!

Deb

[SRADkneedragger]

wish we could take our "side car" rig to the mile but thats not happening anytime soon. Early 70's GT750 Suzuki WaterBuffalo! Sidehack PLATFORM no sissy side car bassani chambers slammed and UGLY! Maybe next time
SRAD
Heavy Bus Racing

[isiahstites]

I have seen VERY ill affects on the ability of a Busa to handle correctly with a few 25lbs bags of shot thrown under "the hump" or even under the tank.  I can imagine what a two up would do on shut down. 

Scott maybe it is because I am sleep deprived right now, but are you saying the handling was not good with the weight in the hump?

Scott

[jasontmc]

I have seen VERY ill affects on the ability of a Busa to handle correctly with a few 25lbs bags of shot thrown under "the hump" or even under the tank.  I can imagine what a two up would do on shut down. 

Scott maybe it is because I am sleep deprived right now, but are you saying the handling was not good with the weight in the hump?

Scott

Scott,

a turbo busa will wag it's tail all the way down the course. Now put 30-50lbs two feet rearward and one foot above the c of g and you will find  yourself changing your shorts on the return road!

[isiahstites]

I have seen VERY ill affects on the ability of a Busa to handle correctly with a few 25lbs bags of shot thrown under "the hump" or even under the tank.  I can imagine what a two up would do on shut down. 

Scott maybe it is because I am sleep deprived right now, but are you saying the handling was not good with the weight in the hump?

Scott

Scott,

a turbo busa will wag it's tail all the way down the course. Now put 30-50lbs two feet rearward and one foot above the c of g and you will find  yourself changing your shorts on the return road!

Thats what I thought.........

[DahMurf]

I haven't found the video but I have found a few pics




I'm hoping that last one is right after launch. I would think that they both need to be further down & forward. 

John, did they give any feedback on the ride & shut down handling after the run?

Deb

[isiahstites]

I would be curious to hear back about the handling as well. Looking at the picture it really looks like the front end is not loaded and the bikes headlights are pointing upwards a bit instead of on the track.........on a lakebed, no thanks.

Scott

[Oz Booster]

I get the impression the centre of pressure changes may be greater than the centre of gravity change as a handling issue just looking at the side on pic..
be interesting to get the riders perspective of that run,

[JR Killiany]

I have been in contact with Andy Sills.  He is currently participating in the BUB at Bonneville.

He agreed to answer any and probably all questions you might have concerning his 2 Up ridng at Bonneville.

He wanted me to pass on to you that he rides a lot and does not have much time for emailing.  Any that his email responses will probably have many typos which he hopes you will excuse.

He is very interested in someone providing a high power motorcycle so he can run 200-mph 2 Up.  He used the term 222 meaning 2-Up, 2-miles, 200-mph.

His 2-Up run at Bonneville was a one time deal.  He does not think that the opportunity will present itself again at Bonneville.

JR Killiany

The following was his email respone to my inquire just before he left for Bonneville:

John-

nice to hear from you. Shiva is a good friend of mine. a couple of years ago, erin hunter and i made an unofficial (but authorized) 2up pass at the Bub International Motorcycle Speed Trials/ Bonneville, Ut. As far as I know, there is no sanctioned (FIM, Bub,AMA,or SCTA) 2up speed trial or even speed record. Erin and I were able to make our pass as a one time only, special dispensation worked out between me and the Bub organizers... it has not been allowed since.
My understanding is that the event insurance would not cover such an activity so on and so forth, blah blah and as such, it is frowned upon officially. Erin and I have been riding for years together, both separately and 2up. Of the 35,000 miles a year that I ride (no day job), at least 15,000 miles are accumulate in the high desert of nevada, southern utah and northern arizona where we can be relatively safe and under the radar of thoes who would not like our cruising speeds of 140-170 mph, hour after hour, day after day etc. the 169 at bville was virtually spontaneous, unplanned and a total no brainer. we were limited on the top speed by the fact that our ride was a stock, factory sponsored bmw k1200. as a result of our unique riding patterns over the past ten years i think i can say that we have more experience than anyone at 150-170 (both 2up and tip to tail) but have not been able to enjoy higher speeds because we dont own Busas or Kawasakis (I have ridden a Hbusa 196 @ bville) . Erin and I would both like to take our two up riding over the 200+ threshold if we could find someone to offer us the machine to do it. For now, our arsenal consists of a Honda F4i, HD Duce, BMW R1200s, BMW K1200s and an BMW HP2Sport (on which i have managed to accumulate 9200 miles since picking it up in Las Vegas 6 weeks ago). I have been racing at Bonneville for the past eight years. Erin started a solo land speed career last year. I would be happy to be involved in helping to get a 2up event off the ground and i would be even more excited about someone building a two up busa or zx14 which erin and i could pilot to an eventual record. hmmmm???
On saturday, erin and i are riding to bonneville for this years Bub event wherein i will be riding a 50cc sled -see photo below-(http://www.speedtrialsbybub.com/2008_event/index-2008.html also http://www.50cc-land-speed-racing.com/ ). i am currently involved in a 4 year project with Eric Manning, son of dennis manning (worlds fastest motorcycle streamliner/350mph), on a 50cc project which will ultimately break a 35 year old still standing record for a 50cc streamliner set in the early 80's (140 mph) . Five years ago I set a world record in the 100cc motorcycle streamliner class at 141 mph in the Jack Costella creation "Nebulous Theorum IV 50/50". That record has not been eclipsed but next week, Erin will be trying to up my record in the same vehicle at the Bub speed trials. We are leaving on saturday and will be gone for a week. as i said, i would love to participate in a 2x2x2 (two up, two mile, two hundred) effort.

Here is Andy Sills email address: andysills@mac.com

JR Killiany