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Author Topic: my reflash dock is running!!!  (Read 10117 times)

Offline whtrthanu

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my reflash dock is running!!!
« on: October 17, 2008, 11:19:01 PM »
finished up my dock the other day, started using all the software........This is really great stuff......I didnt realize how complicated the stock ecu was.......alot of tuning capabilities.......Gonna take time to get used to everything, but the rev limiters are pretty easy to do..........gonna try to do some testing on the dyno this weekend and check out the timing and fuel maps........
it wasnt too hard getting it all going............ :thumb:


Offline whtrthanu

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2008, 11:34:44 PM »
i will post up some of the data screens, theres like thousands of pages of info....


Offline busa2001

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2008, 11:39:31 PM »
what are you using ECU EDITOR OR RAMRAIDER.... I use both.... :thumb:

Offline whtrthanu

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2008, 11:52:11 PM »
i use both also


Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2008, 03:00:58 AM »
Very good !

What is the reflashing speed in your setup 30sec or 3min ? ... and do you have intentions of mapping the bikes in a dyno too ?

There is a link to the mapping library in the ECUeditor. It works so that if you are signed in to the yahoo group with maps then you automatically get updated maps. If youre not signed in then you can ask for a map over email from any of the users. Lets also try to keep the map library very active and post different maps into there - not so much as a map sharing as its to inform the others that a certain type of bike has been already mapped.

Every bike is unique, a good base map just makes dyno operators work easier. Sharing a map is a culture I would like everyone to attend. The more everyone posts maps here the better information we have. Also we know that the most active posters are propably most experienced with all this stuff.

http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/ecueditor/





« Last Edit: October 18, 2008, 03:12:49 AM by PetriK »

Offline Stocker64

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #7 on: October 18, 2008, 04:37:34 AM »
wow looks like this is flashing technology is starting to catch on over here petrik!!
09 BUSA, PROBLEMCHILD II.... tuned with the factory ecu by ME!! thanks PETRIK, ridgeracer,and SMITHBUSA. ...  "FAMILY FIRST"...

Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #8 on: October 18, 2008, 06:08:30 AM »
wow looks like this is flashing technology is starting to catch on over here petrik!!

Yes - I really hope so, i think that the knowledge and tools are there now.

I also hope that when ever someone offer services for money from using this free information and software that they would put some money DaveOs memorial fund when ever they earn some.

Offline whtrthanu

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2008, 08:07:10 AM »
 :thumb:

Offline busa2001

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2008, 12:52:44 PM »
we encourage all the flashers :) to share their maps.... :thumb: to keep the community growing.. :thumb:

Offline Stocker64

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2008, 02:31:58 PM »
wow looks like this is flashing technology is starting to catch on over here petrik!!

Yes - I really hope so, i think that the knowledge and tools are there now.

I also hope that when ever someone offer services for money from using this free information and software that they would put some money DaveOs memorial fund when ever they earn some.

I Thank you  rr,jasa,bozo,busa2001 and everyone who was involved in making this technology available for all of us to use.AT petrik's wishes i hope everyone helps ot dave-o's family :thumb:
09 BUSA, PROBLEMCHILD II.... tuned with the factory ecu by ME!! thanks PETRIK, ridgeracer,and SMITHBUSA. ...  "FAMILY FIRST"...

Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2008, 03:49:48 PM »

Let me know when you are ready to start dynoing bikes by reflashing and I can then share some lessons learned - most of which are just trivialities, but makes learning curve faster and results better.

E.g. increasing the flashing speed is one target - i have seen installations that take 30s and oters that take 3min to reflash. In dyno we want this to be fairly short time.




Offline whtrthanu

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2008, 09:14:17 PM »
so far no more than 30 seconds to flash

Offline glenn71

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #14 on: October 18, 2008, 09:55:41 PM »
What would be useful if the service was offered remotely was to correlate a pc3usb map  and relate those changes to the ecu reflash,its not perfect and goes down the road of downloadable power commander maps not being as good as a custom tune but if someone was happy with their pc map the reflash could potentially be a least as good and at least it was based on a proven tune on their bike.
Gen1 the original and the best
8.76@165.42mph so far

Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #15 on: October 19, 2008, 01:36:13 AM »
Excellent - the speed is correct for dynoing. Now a couple of practical things which may be trivialities, but lets just mention those over here:

- TPS map is intended for tuning TPS position 10-100%. Tune every TPS position at a time. Have the datastream screen available for you to see the TPS position through out the run. Tuning below 10% does not affect anything. That is just a fail safe area if the IAP map fails. This part of the tuning is very alike to tuning with powercommander or yoshimura ems. Just change the cell values.

- IAP map is intended for tuning at any fixed RPM at time. Set the dyno to maintain the RPM and vary the throttle. You can monitor the AFR from your dyno screen and the exact map position on ECUeditor map to tune on the fuel or ignition map screen. Often I just paint a bigger area, maybe 5x2 cells and make changes with - - -.

I usually first tune one IAP area and then one TPS area during one run. That way the engine does not heat too much.

Colour codes mean values compared to original map or any map set by set compare map.

Increasing cell value is + by one and * by 5% more. - and / works the opposite way.

Often at around 2000-3000rpm 70-100% TPS there is way too much fuel on TPS area, sometimes so much that it makes me wonder why suzuki designed it that way. The rest of the map is fairly easy to tune.

This is in a nutshell for what I have learned with my around 1000 runs this summer and with feedback from additional couple of thousands by others dyning.

Let us know how it goes and we can take it from there when questions arise.


Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #16 on: October 19, 2008, 04:05:03 AM »
While watching a very boring F1 race from internet TV wrote a bit more detailed instructions for dynoing a bike using the ECUeditor.

Any comments and questions to the below will be appreciated...

Dyno process with ECUeditor

1. Check the engine data monitor connection and check the TPS setting
- Connect the cable to the bike and your computer
- Start ECUeditor and press "Connect ECU for engine data"
- Turn bike power on
- You should see "Datastream Active" text on top of the screen, if not turn bike power off and back on
- Turn throttle. At idle position the TPS should show 1.2% at full throttle it should show 100%. Adjust TPS

accordingly to get these readings.
- Turn bike power off

2. Load the basemap which is closest to the engine in question to ECUeditor
- Use "File open" command to open the map in question

3. Fill in the bike details and save a new base map file
- Press "Update bike info" and type in the bike data
- Save the file under new name using "File Save" command. This stores the updated bike info and gives you a
new working base map file.

4. Set ECU to dynomode set desired RPM limiter and flash a basic map to the ecu
- Using advanced settings set "Gearing/Dynomode" setting to dynomode. This fixes the Ram Air compensation to

a fixed air speed that the dyno fans are generating. Using dynomode allows precice tuning of maps at a fixed

air speed. At the end of the dyno session you set the gearing that the bike has and that re-enables ram air

compensation for that gearing.
- Set RPM limiter to desired level.
- Flash the basemap with dynomode enabled and RPM set to ECU by pressing "Flash the ECU" button. Before

flashing turn bike power on. If power was on, turn it off and back on to reset the ecu.

5. Tune the TPS 11%-100% area at each throttle position at the time
- Click "Connect to Engine Data" and turn engine power off (if it was not not already) and back on. Setting the engine data on you can see directly on the map which area you are tuning.
- Select "Edit Fuel Map(s)" and you the fuel map chart will be opened. On the top of the screen there is three major buttons. "TPS fuelmap" which is tuning TPS/RPM map for TPS positons over 10%. "IAP fuelmap" which is for tuning Vacuum/RPM positions for TPS <10%. "MS Fuelmap" which is to tune the MS (secondary) map for over 10% area.
- Start with 11% area and progress each TPS position at the time up to 100%.
- Make a dyno run with a steady TPS position, check the AFR for each RPM range from the AFR curve from dyno. Adjust the TPS map accordingly.
- Its good practise to modify the next higher TPS area when you make changes to TPS position you are tuning. This is because thats where you end up doing changes next. Anyway over the time everyone develops their desired method for tuning.
- Very often the RPM range between 2000-4000 needs significant leaning out if the bike has an aftermarket exhaust fitted
- Changes are made by painting the cells with mouse and then pressing +,-,* or /. The numbers on the map are not directly related to milliseconds, those are rather volumetric efficiency for the engine at any given TPS/IAP/RPM position.

Even Ignition maps are not mentioned here specifically, those are alike to TPS maps. Ignition is always TPS/RPM map, there is no IAP ignition map.

6. Tune IAP map at each RPM area at the time
- Tuning IAP map not alike to tuning TPS map. The IAP is vacuum so often its easier to have a fixed RPM and tune accordingly. Other than that making changes are similar.
- Click "Connect to Engine Data" and turn engine power off (if it was not not already) and back on. Setting the engine data on you can see directly on the map which area you are tuning.
- Choose an RPM area in your mind and run against that RPM area with varying TPS positions to get different IAP (vacuum) readings. Monitor the AFR on the dyno and change the map accordingly. Usually its better to paint an area of size of 2x5 or even 4x8 for changing the map based on AFR reading.

7. Set ECU back to desired gearing setting and flash the final map to the ecu
- At the end of the dyno session do remember to go to "Advanced Settings" and update the dynomode to gearing

that the bike has. This way the ram air compensation gets enabled to deliver more fuel at higher speeds.

(Anyway when when ever dynoing and adjusting the afr the gearing should be in dynomode so that a fixed air

speed is used for calculating the fuel.)

8. Save the final map with a clearly distinctive name
- File Save under a clearly distinctive name which you can find from your computer. Its a good practise to

e.g. add a word finished at the end of the map file name so that you know which file was the latest version.
- Flash the final file to the bike. Its important to remember doing this so that the RAM air works properly.

9. Send the map to map library using map sharing function
- The ECUeditor is an open community product. The free use of the ECUeditor is based on the concept that the users are sharing their maps. In case if you are not actively sharing your maps the ECUeditor will lock out until you have shared some maps. This map sharing policy applies also to dyno stations. The purpose here is not to let everyone copy others work - its quite opposite. As each bike is different this approach allows ECUeditor to share the experience and generate cumulative knowledge of this new way of tuning. There is so much more into getting most out of the engine includingg the capability to unify cylinder maps, to tweak the ignition maps, to change the ignition dwell. Sharing maps will make dynoing easier for those who really are serious in tuning in a dyno the engines they have built. Dynoing is a professional service that can not be copied just copying a map. Its an unique opportunity to tweak the engine for getting most out of it. I am sure that the real engine entusiast with high power engines will in soon choose a dyno operator based on the skills they demonstrate by choosing to share the maps as proving new ways of finding more power. Simply setting up a straight AFR line and a good base map is not anymore enough for us who understand that there is so much more into getting the most out of the engine !

10. Testdrive and enjoy the driveability changes
- Most bike owners will be surprised how much better the the part throttle response is. Particularly turbos and highly modified bikes will benefit greatly from this 'treatment'.

« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 04:30:31 AM by PetriK »

Offline Stocker64

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #17 on: October 19, 2008, 06:55:52 AM »
WOW,great write-up petrik,that should make it easier to flash for all who have not done it. :thumb:
09 BUSA, PROBLEMCHILD II.... tuned with the factory ecu by ME!! thanks PETRIK, ridgeracer,and SMITHBUSA. ...  "FAMILY FIRST"...

Offline whtrthanu

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2008, 08:27:15 AM »
DAMN!!!!!! :thumb:

Offline sportbikeryder

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2008, 09:04:53 AM »
Pertik,
     If you ever find yourself in jail and looking for Bail money, be sure to hit up myself and the rest of the community. We will get you out.  :lol:   
Thanks again for all of your work.
 :thumb: :thumb:
Any day on a motorcycle like this that ends just needing parts and labor is a good day.
4.82, 158.67mph 1/8th mile 7.350, 200.32mph 1/4 mile Riding

4.47, 175mph 1/8th mile  6.76, 216mph 1/4 mile Tuning

Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #20 on: October 19, 2008, 09:55:06 AM »
Pertik,
     If you ever find yourself in jail and looking for Bail money, be sure to hit up myself and the rest of the community. We will get you out.  :lol:   
Thanks again for all of your work.
 :thumb: :thumb:

Thanks for your support - even though I really hope that it never comes to that for any of us.

Just out of curiosity - does anyone know if there is more to what is written on this story:
http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=99460&p=3&topicID=18013038
I mean according to that dynoing a bike with an extension module is a violation to emission laws ? Is it really so in USA ?

Offline jettscott

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #21 on: October 19, 2008, 03:08:22 PM »
Since all of this is over my head, please answer a few questions if you don't mind... What can actually be done to a '08 bike?  Can the limiter be removed?  Can all three maps be re-written?  Is it possible to write a map that can be downloaded to PC III, then to the bike?  Is it possible to have a map emailed to you? 

I turn wrenches very well, but this is something that I've never been involved in, but what you guys are doing is amazing!

Offline PetriK

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #22 on: October 19, 2008, 03:12:17 PM »
When I finally get on my hands one spare K8-K9 busa ecu for diving into it, I hope that all this will become possible for K8-K9 owners too.


Offline glenn71

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #23 on: October 19, 2008, 03:15:52 PM »
Nice to know the gen1 owners get a head start on this style of tuning. :D
Gen1 the original and the best
8.76@165.42mph so far

Offline sportbikeryder

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Re: my reflash dock is running!!!
« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2008, 03:18:06 PM »
so far no more than 30 seconds to flash

Do you have any special settings on your USB COM port to acheive this 30 second flash? Mine used to be 180 sec, I have gotten it to 169 seconds by tweaking the com port latency speed.
Any day on a motorcycle like this that ends just needing parts and labor is a good day.
4.82, 158.67mph 1/8th mile 7.350, 200.32mph 1/4 mile Riding

4.47, 175mph 1/8th mile  6.76, 216mph 1/4 mile Tuning