Unable to edit values in ecueditor

[Blue08Busa]

I am not sure if I am just looking over something stupid or what, but I am unable to change the values of any of the cells in ecueditor.  I can check and uncheck options.  I am able to scan, and to flash.   Not sure what I am missing here.  Anyone know what I might be doing wrong?

Thanks
Ben

[Blue08Busa]

Nevermind.  I just realized that you have to use the plus and minus buttons to adjust them.  I fiigured you could type numbers in the cells.

[smithabusa]

+ and - for 1 unit increments
* and / for 5% increase & decrease

[sportbikeryder]

+ and - for 1 unit increments
* and / for 5% increase & decrease

just a note, the + and - for 1 unit increments is just as it says, units, not 1% increments.

[smithabusa]

yep yep, people have a very hard time with that, yep if the number in a cell is 249, and you hit plus, its goes to 250.

If you hit * it would go to 249 + (249*.05) = 261.45 which would get rounded down to 261.

[sportbikeryder]

yep yep, people have a very hard time with that, yep if the number in a cell is 249, and you hit plus, its goes to 250.

If you hit * it would go to 249 + (249*.05) = 261.45 which would get rounded down to 261.

The imcrement vs. % makes it a bit difficult to trim a map sometimes as well. Maybe we should look into a third option set of buttons for +/- 1%.   Who am I kidding....maybe we can convince PetriK to add a third set of buttons...

[PetriK]

For inexperienced user - maybe difficult. We dynoed my bike back to gasoline (from E85) today and tested that NLR SIM really works. The final changes are often around 1-2 units, changing the units to 1% increments would be too much in most cases, so we should be making 0.5% changes and that would generate a need for a decimal to be shown.

[Blue08Busa]

Ok.  I got that down now.  I have another question though.  I was playing with the "apply map" feature.  I know that it is in the testing phase, but if it works properly and use that and open a power commander 5 map it should theoretically adjust the map to run like the power commander map was programmed right?  Well I tried this from a stock map.  My values were all over the place.  Some of my WOT changes were like 50 units and other crazy numbers like that.  Percentages of change were in the 20's and 30s.  My percentages on the pcv map werent near that high, and a lot of wot is only 20% on the lower injectors.  That means that in one cell my pcv was making a 13% addition to only 20% of the total fuel.  However when I "applied map" it showed that same wot cell adding 23% to my fuel.  I am asuming that these changes would be to both sets of injectors correct?  If so that is an  extreem amount more fuel than what the pcv map was adding.  That is what this feature is supposed to do right?  If so I am guessing that there is some kind of glitch going on here.

Thanks
Ben

[sportbikeryder]

Ok.  I got that down now.  I have another question though.  I was playing with the "apply map" feature.  I know that it is in the testing phase, but if it works properly and use that and open a power commander 5 map it should theoretically adjust the map to run like the power commander map was programmed right?  Well I tried this from a stock map.  My values were all over the place.  Some of my WOT changes were like 50 units and other crazy numbers like that.  Percentages of change were in the 20's and 30s.  My percentages on the pcv map werent near that high, and a lot of wot is only 20% on the lower injectors.  That means that in one cell my pcv was making a 13% addition to only 20% of the total fuel.  However when I "applied map" it showed that same wot cell adding 23% to my fuel.  I am asuming that these changes would be to both sets of injectors correct?  If so that is an  extreem amount more fuel than what the pcv map was adding.  That is what this feature is supposed to do right?  If so I am guessing that there is some kind of glitch going on here.

Thanks
Ben

Can't help you there...I am a lowly gen 1 user. I have not yet flashed a gen2....maybe I do need to go buy a Gen2...

[smithabusa]

Ok.  I got that down now.  I have another question though.  I was playing with the "apply map" feature.  I know that it is in the testing phase, but if it works properly and use that and open a power commander 5 map it should theoretically adjust the map to run like the power commander map was programmed right?  Well I tried this from a stock map.  My values were all over the place.  Some of my WOT changes were like 50 units and other crazy numbers like that.  Percentages of change were in the 20's and 30s.  My percentages on the pcv map werent near that high, and a lot of wot is only 20% on the lower injectors.  That means that in one cell my pcv was making a 13% addition to only 20% of the total fuel.  However when I "applied map" it showed that same wot cell adding 23% to my fuel.  I am asuming that these changes would be to both sets of injectors correct?  If so that is an  extreem amount more fuel than what the pcv map was adding.  That is what this feature is supposed to do right?  If so I am guessing that there is some kind of glitch going on here.

Thanks
Ben

theres a lengthy post on that on the hack forum, short answer is due to the nature of power commander only controlling 1 set of injectors, it is not recommended to use the apply map function with power commander maps, bazzaz maps sure, but not power commander.

[Blue08Busa]

Fair enough.  Still doesnt explain why the apply map function was adding a higher percentage of fuel to my ecu map than what I was adding to the power commander map in the first place.  I guess it doesnt really matter though since like you said, it just doesnt seem practical since you the pcv map was only controlling one set of injectors as opposed to both.  I guess the only way that would work is if the function calculated for each cell of the pcv map what percentage of fuel was being delivered by the primary injectors, and calculated your new map based on that.

[smithabusa]

yes it does make sense, your lower injectors that your power commander is controlling only contribute 20% of the entire fuel flow at high rpm wide open throttle.

So in a power commander you to get the bike's overall fuel flow up by 10%, requires a number of 50% in the power commander table. now do a map conversion and ecu applies 50% to the fuel table, which is the fuel table for the engine, not for lower injectors only, so a 50% fuel increase is HUUUUUUGE.

[Blue08Busa]

What I am saying is that on my power commander table it is only showing a 13% change.  That is only 13% of 20% correct(WOT @10,000 rpm)?  That would be .13 x .20.  That gives me .026 which is 2.6% rounded up would be 3%.  So adding 13% on the power commander is adding less than 3% total fuel right. 

 Now how come when I apply this map in ecu editor, that same cell(WOT @10,000 rpm) goes from 213 to to 262.  That is a 23% addition.  That is a larger percentage than even the power commander is adding to just the lower injectors.

Thanks
Ben

[smithabusa]

What I am saying is that on my power commander table it is only showing a 13% change.  That is only 13% of 20% correct(WOT @10,000 rpm)?  That would be .13 x .20.  That gives me .026 which is 2.6% rounded up would be 3%.  So adding 13% on the power commander is adding less than 3% total fuel right. 

 Now how come when I apply this map in ecu editor, that same cell(WOT @10,000 rpm) goes from 213 to to 262.  That is a 23% addition.  That is a larger percentage than even the power commander is adding to just the lower injectors.

Thanks
Ben

don't know on that, but either way 13 or 23% is way too much.  yes you are correct on your math

[PetriK]

Not really as powercommander only connects to one set of injectors so those maps are really useless unless used together with injector balance map. Example:
- TPS 10%, RPM 2000, Primaries 100%, secondaries 0%
- TPS 100%, RPM 10000, Primaries 20%, Secondaries 80%
So as one can see accross the map the percentages will have different meaning.

Then another thing is that this is really a VE map not injector opening map as I see the role of it. So its useless to talk about injector opening % at the same time when we really are tuning VE, but maybe this gets too complex to analyze further.

Do you tune a lot of bikes in dyno ?  For almost every week for this year we have neen doing 2-5 gen2 busas in a week and come to this way of tuning just because it seems to be best and easiest from tuners perspective. If youre running several busas in a week I am really keen on having a dialogue how to improve the tuning process to the detail - as most requests seem to be here nice to have but not really improvements from the tuners perspective.

[Blue08Busa]

No, I do not tune a lot of bikes.  It is just a  hobby of mine, and I help with some friends.  I was not really even suggesting for you to change anything.  I am just trying to further my understanding.  Basically, I have figured out what I needed.  The power commander maps are not very useful as far as transfering over to the ecu maps so I will just start fresh.  Thanks for your help.  And thanks to both Petrik and Greg for great products, and great support.

[Abusive]

Ok.  I got that down now.  I have another question though.  I was playing with the "apply map" feature.  I know that it is in the testing phase, but if it works properly and use that and open a power commander 5 map it should theoretically adjust the map to run like the power commander map was programmed right?  Well I tried this from a stock map.  My values were all over the place.  Some of my WOT changes were like 50 units and other crazy numbers like that.  Percentages of change were in the 20's and 30s.  My percentages on the pcv map werent near that high, and a lot of wot is only 20% on the lower injectors.  That means that in one cell my pcv was making a 13% addition to only 20% of the total fuel.  However when I "applied map" it showed that same wot cell adding 23% to my fuel.  I am asuming that these changes would be to both sets of injectors correct?  If so that is an  extreem amount more fuel than what the pcv map was adding.  That is what this feature is supposed to do right?  If so I am guessing that there is some kind of glitch going on here.

Thanks
Ben

Can't help you there...I am a lowly gen 1 user. I have not yet flashed a gen2....maybe I do need to go buy a Gen2...

John you don't have to buy a Gen II you can  buy all the latest performance parts and in stall them on mine and I'll let you flash it.

[Stocker64]

Ok.  I got that down now.  I have another question though.  I was playing with the "apply map" feature.  I know that it is in the testing phase, but if it works properly and use that and open a power commander 5 map it should theoretically adjust the map to run like the power commander map was programmed right?  Well I tried this from a stock map.  My values were all over the place.  Some of my WOT changes were like 50 units and other crazy numbers like that.  Percentages of change were in the 20's and 30s.  My percentages on the pcv map werent near that high, and a lot of wot is only 20% on the lower injectors.  That means that in one cell my pcv was making a 13% addition to only 20% of the total fuel.  However when I "applied map" it showed that same wot cell adding 23% to my fuel.  I am asuming that these changes would be to both sets of injectors correct?  If so that is an  extreem amount more fuel than what the pcv map was adding.  That is what this feature is supposed to do right?  If so I am guessing that there is some kind of glitch going on here.

Thanks
Ben

Can't help you there...I am a lowly gen 1 user. I have not yet flashed a gen2....maybe I do need to go buy a Gen2...

john just needs to get into the softweare side of things.....

[Blue08Busa]

So when using ecu editor is there no way to edit the values at idle(0%)?  My bike idles a little rough for the first few seconds when I start it up.  It did not do this with the power commander installed.   The idle smooths out when it warms up, so this is not a real issue, but I just wondered if there was any way to do anything about it.  It looks like I can edit the timing table at 0%, but not the fuel. 

Thanks

[PetriK]

IAP map is your idle map, that gives full tuneability for both idle and cruising areas.

[Blue08Busa]

So the IAP fuel map is basically a load based(rpm vs vacuum) map correct?  Does it only tune for neutral/clutch in, or does it tune for when you are in gear as welll?  Also, the MS map is just a extra map correct.  When is it used, or how do you activate it? 

Thanks
Ben

[smithabusa]

Iap is for all fueling when tipover<10%.  Watch my tutorial bids they answer almost all your questions

[Blue08Busa]

I have tried to watch a lot of your videos, and it seems that they almost all tell me that they were unable to be located.  It has been a while since I tried though.  I will try again.

[Blue08Busa]

Well, I just checked back to your site.  The links still dont work if I just click on them.  I did however discover that if I right click and save as I was able to save them on my computer.  I will be watching these tonight and hopefully it will help answer any questions I have left at this point.  Sorry, I just thought that your links were dead.  I thought I had had even tried the right click/save as meathod in the past with no success, but it worked now.  I still am not sure why it made me save them first, but at least I have them now.

[smithabusa]

They are on the CD I send out with flasher as well