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Author Topic: ZX10 build  (Read 760 times)

Offline zrxdean

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ZX10 build
« on: July 19, 2017, 10:01:51 AM »
Hey folks, here's my new low-buck project. I started this build (in 2015) with a bunch of extra parts I had lying around - a ZX10 frame, GSXR wheels, Busa fork, and a hurt Gen 3 engine I bought for $100 off Craigslist. After putting in a good Gen 2 crank I had and going over the Gen 3 engine, I could never get it running. It would try to start, but I think there is either a harness imcompatibility, or the tooth pitch on the crank / clutch basket changed. I sent out the Gen 3 crank to be repaired, and planned to swap it out and try again.

Life got busy, I worked on my house for a year, had some other delays, and finally got back to this project a few months ago. I found a running Gen 2 engine for $700 locally and put it in the chassis. Started right up, yay, back in business. I'll rebuild the Gen 3 engine and have it as a spare when I melt this one :)

Eventually, I plan to run E85 and nitrous, but for now I will try to work out the kinks with a stock engine and E85. I plan to use pails of VP C85 and not worry about pump fuel quality.

The fuel system uses a stock injectors (410cc), a Walbro 255lph pump and Aeromotive regulator. The idea is to flash the ECU for E85 at 43psi, and fine tune with a PC3. When it gets sprayed (dry spraybar), I will Y off the nitrous solenoid and knock it down to 25psi or so with an old Carolina Cycle regulator and feed that into the boost reference port on the FP regulator. Iíll figure the fuel/nitrous ratios by weight before testing on the dyno.  I kinda like the idea of a mechanical fuel bump, as long as I can get the ratios right. Less electronics, I want to keep the bike simple, just a WEGO wideband for logging and a PC3 for tuning.
 

Once the bike is set up, Iíll build the engine for 75hp worth of spray. The fuel system should be good for 250hp on E85 if the injectors can handle 70psi reliably. With a 5lb bottle and a safe tuneup, I should be able to spray for a whole mile :)

Dean

Online KZScott

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #1 on: July 19, 2017, 07:58:46 PM »
Ive wanted to do a dry shot like that for a long time, but never got around to it. once the reg is set for X jetting, you dont have to worry about map switching or other weirdness messing up
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 on dot tires, pump gas, NO power adders.... turbo 8.47 @ 164
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot... turbo 8.32 @ 173
00 ZX-12R  1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB Worlds Fastest NA Kawasaki
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1  1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
Fabricator/Engine builder @ RCC Turbos

Offline RansomT

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2017, 09:58:30 PM »
A fuel recommendation.  Ignite race fuel.  They have several Ethanol blends ranging from E85 to Ignite 114.  I've been using 114 for several years and since I switched over, never have had a sign of detonation. Good stuff.
Fastest 1.5-Mile Pass - 252.222
Fastest 1-Mile Pass - 244.2997
Half Mile - 211.47
Fastest Nitrous Bike
Production Bike
211.079 LTA. P/P 1350

Offline osti33

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2017, 04:00:07 AM »
Looks great Dean!

Love the cherry bomb muffler!!  :hys:
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Bonneville, Loring, ECTA, Texas, Mojave

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #4 on: July 20, 2017, 05:44:08 AM »
That's the kinda cheap bastard I am :) It matches rustoleum red perfectly!

Thanks for the fuel tip Ransom, but I don't see a distributor in Georgia. Have you had trouble with C85?

Dean

Offline Nosgsx1300

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2017, 06:49:16 AM »
HUH whats C85???
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2011 Loring 204.88mph "naked"
2015 Loring 220.01743 MPH Faired in fifth gear

Offline RansomT

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2017, 07:05:10 AM »
C85 is VP's version of E85.  I "think" the ethanol content is around 80%, while E85 is closer to 75%.
Fastest 1.5-Mile Pass - 252.222
Fastest 1-Mile Pass - 244.2997
Half Mile - 211.47
Fastest Nitrous Bike
Production Bike
211.079 LTA. P/P 1350

Offline RansomT

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2017, 07:10:21 AM »
That's the kinda cheap bastard I am :) It matches rustoleum red perfectly!

Thanks for the fuel tip Ransom, but I don't see a distributor in Georgia. Have you had trouble with C85?

Dean

Not really.  C85 has a lower ethanol content that Ignite 114 and makes a few HP less on the dyno.  However, C85 is a whole lot better than pump E85.  I do like C85 for cold weather starts.  In Maine, when the morning temps are in the 40s, I do have boost my bike on the first start of the day when using Ignite. After that it starts just fine.

I got started with Ignite because some of the really fast nitrous car guys (drag racing) were using it and when they had detonation problems with C85.  But we are talking BIG shots too.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2017, 07:13:38 AM by RansomT »
Fastest 1.5-Mile Pass - 252.222
Fastest 1-Mile Pass - 244.2997
Half Mile - 211.47
Fastest Nitrous Bike
Production Bike
211.079 LTA. P/P 1350

Offline Landspeed Larry

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2017, 05:09:02 PM »
Glad to see you back in the game Dean. You have done it all in LSR. Now enjoy your family and play with your ZX-10R as time allows. Nice when you don't have to be at any particular race, just go when you feel like it. That's what Steve and I are doing and it is a Kawasaki drag bike.   :bike:     LSR
All motor all the time and a turbo now and then.

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2017, 08:16:35 AM »
Thanks for the info Ransom, I think my moderate shot will be ok with C85, the convenience of an in-town VP provider is hard to beat.

Larry, I'd love to see a picture of the drag bike, is it a NA ZX14?

I got the brakes on last night, took a little convincing to get the Suzuki and Kawasaki parts playing together :)


Offline Landspeed Larry

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2017, 02:35:23 PM »
Dean: Scroll down to the ZX-14 section and click on the Carbonator thread. Guess I have been hanging around greenie guys too much.   LSL
All motor all the time and a turbo now and then.

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2017, 06:46:23 PM »
Nice!

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2017, 08:44:51 PM »
Thanks for the info Ransom, I think my moderate shot will be ok with C85, the convenience of an in-town VP provider is hard to beat.

Larry, I'd love to see a picture of the drag bike, is it a NA ZX14?

I got the brakes on last night, took a little convincing to get the Suzuki and Kawasaki parts playing together :)



Looks good Dean , wondered when we would see you back
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Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #13 on: July 22, 2017, 09:03:54 AM »
Hey Greg, it's good to be working on a bike again.  :fiddy:

Got the injectors back, they flow 560cc at 75psi :)

Offline RansomT

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #14 on: July 22, 2017, 09:40:09 AM »
Speaking of Ethanol.  When you start tuning, you will need about 30% more fuel going from pump gas to E85.  If you use "the gas scale", AFR should be a touch richer than with pump gas.  Typically, on motor only pump gas likes 13.1-13.2 for most power while E85 likes 12.8-12.9. However, Ethanol has a bigger tuning window.  Timing is the same as gasoline.  Under nitrous, aim for a AFR (gas scale) of 11.5:1.  Bigger the shot, the richer you can go. 
Fastest 1.5-Mile Pass - 252.222
Fastest 1-Mile Pass - 244.2997
Half Mile - 211.47
Fastest Nitrous Bike
Production Bike
211.079 LTA. P/P 1350

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #15 on: July 22, 2017, 10:52:02 PM »
Thanks Ransom. I was expecting to gain a few NA hp advancing the ignition timing, did you not find any advantage? Do you retard with spray?

Offline RansomT

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #16 on: July 22, 2017, 11:05:17 PM »
You will gain a few HP just from going to ethanol from pump.  A couple of degrees of timing will also help, but ethanol doesn't like a bunch of timing because of the way it burns.  The flame front is quicker but is less explosive than gas based race fuel.   Timing with nitrous: I have found it makes just as much power with a more conservative timing curve.  2 degrees for the first 50 HP and 3 degrees there after.  e.g. 7 degrees out for 100 HP shot.  13 degrees out for 200 HP shot.
Fastest 1.5-Mile Pass - 252.222
Fastest 1-Mile Pass - 244.2997
Half Mile - 211.47
Fastest Nitrous Bike
Production Bike
211.079 LTA. P/P 1350

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #17 on: July 23, 2017, 09:12:41 PM »
Good to know. I think I will just buy a Woolich ECU tuning kit and I can experiment with timing, and fine tune fuel without the PC3.

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #18 on: July 30, 2017, 03:02:01 PM »
Decided to just send Ryan Schnitz the ECU for flashing and use the PC for fine tuning.

Got the sprockets lined up, chain guard mounted, brakes bled, kill tether wired, 24V starting, fuel and coolant systems leak tested, bike up to temp and running OK.

I have a lot of front sprockets for the ZX10, but need to order some 525 rears for the GSXR wheel. I have no clue what gearing to shoot for in the half mile, any suggestions? Was thinking to order a 41.

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #19 on: August 19, 2017, 02:54:52 PM »
Bike is almost ready for Clayton. Got the WEGO logger working, chassis sorted, and it's burning E85 nicely. Thanks to Ryan Schnitz for fast service, I have 4 degrees advance on base map, and 4 retard on map 2.


It's geared for 170 in 5th, so if it runs right we'll see what it can do. The cherry bomb actually sounds pretty good  :mrgreen:

Dean

Offline osti33

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2017, 04:39:10 AM »
Bike is almost ready for Clayton. Got the WEGO logger working, chassis sorted, and it's burning E85 nicely. Thanks to Ryan Schnitz for fast service, I have 4 degrees advance on base map, and 4 retard on map 2.


It's geared for 170 in 5th, so if it runs right we'll see what it can do. The cherry bomb actually sounds pretty good  :mrgreen:

Dean


Looking good Dean. Can't wait to hear how it runs.  :thumb:
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Bonneville, Loring, ECTA, Texas, Mojave

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2017, 08:39:17 PM »
Swapped out the fork and fabbed some bottle brackets for the future  :mrgreen:


Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2017, 12:11:34 PM »
Took it to the dragstrip last night and got three passes. I had set the base fuel pressure at 40 and it was lean up top. Got it pretty close and ran 9.76 @ 146. Engine felt great, torquey. Everyone loved the cherry bomb :). Dean

Online KZScott

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #23 on: August 27, 2017, 06:24:29 PM »
lets see a pic of the tuck with the bars way down there?
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 on dot tires, pump gas, NO power adders.... turbo 8.47 @ 164
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot... turbo 8.32 @ 173
00 ZX-12R  1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB Worlds Fastest NA Kawasaki
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1  1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
Fabricator/Engine builder @ RCC Turbos

Offline zrxdean

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Re: ZX10 build
« Reply #24 on: August 28, 2017, 09:41:06 AM »
Definitely not built for comfort :)