Ported Hayabusa Head...The Truth!!!

[johnsmithbusa]

First off, let me say this, my dad would be furious and fire me if he knew i was posting this.  This is what everybody would like to know about a ported Hayabusa head.  We have spent a lot of time and money on the engine dyno to find out.  We built a 1397 engine.  I wont tell you what pistons were in it, but i will tell you that all motors were all 14.7-15:1 compression ratio when assembled.  We left this engine on the dyno at all times and only changed the heads.  We had 4 guys from the shop to purchase heads from people we felt were the most competitive.  That way we knew we would get a "run of the mill" head, not one prepped special for us.  We flowed every head from .100 to .450 lift that we purchased.  Stock valves were used, and the springs and retainers were that of porters choice.  We used a set of bored throttle bodies, our 385 lift cams (intake and exhaust) because some heads were only set up for this size camshaft.  The cams were all set at 105 intake, 107 exhaust.  We used the stock rods and crankshaft with counter balancer.  We used 2003 ignition system, a sidewinder exhaust (can?t tell you which one).  The dyno room was climate controlled (72-74 degrees Fahrenheit) and the motors were mapped accordingly, with VP-MXR01 fuel.  Some people may think that we didnt dyno some heads that should have been tested, but we know that a lot of shops outsource the porting and claim they were the ones who put in the work.  For instance, APE heads are ported by a guy named Spaz.  APE does a valve job and assembles the head, but claim its an APE head.  Lees Performance is another that does the same thing, using Vance & Hines to c&c port the head and sent back to Lees Performance for valve job and assembly.  Paul Gass is another example.  Carpenter does a lot of heads for shops, some tell the truth, some dont.  One of the ones who tells the truth is Motorhead.  He uses Carpenters heads most of the time.

Here is a list of the top ten (ported stock intake & exhaust, all hp were taken from an engine dyno, the following are rear wheel.  Rear wheel hp rating was attained using a 13% reduction for drivetrain):
Ward-235
Sharkey-234
Carpenter-230
Vance & Hines Racing-229
Gann-229
Superbike Mike-221
Performance Porting(Jason)-220
C&W-220
Spaz-218
Wharthanu-216

We ran 5 heads with 1mm bigger intake and exhaust valves:
Ward-237
Sharkey-237
V&HR-235
Carpenter-235
Superbike Mike-224

Best Air Speed of top 5(in order):
V&HR
Sharkey
Ward
Gann
Carpenter

I'm sure that people have made more horsepower with different combinations, but we didn't touch the bottom end.  We only changed the heads, used the same camshaft and set it at 105 intake, 107 exhaust.  These were the results, you could probably change things a little and tweek out a little more horsepower.  If you used one of the top 5, you would be within 5hp no matter which one you bought.  We have decided, if Suzuki doesn't change the Hayabusa engine, by testing Ward and Sharkeys heads, we will redesign our porting and be number one again by next year.

Anonymous

[dakinebusa]

Dat be one teriffic post if it is what it claims to be.
It is no surprise to me that a no flowbench guy like Spaz is not near the top.
I would like to know what a good stock head does in this test configuration.
Congratulations for putting up real data from a Brake dynomometer instead of wishy washy Dyno Jet data.
I would also like to know how much variability there is if the same setup is tested several times in the same state.

[DaveO]

Very good info....not surprised in the least by results....The only other piece of info needed IMO is were any of the heads decked, and how much????

Nice post....refreshing.....Thanx

Dave

[AIRTIME MOTORSPORTS]

WHO IS SHARKEY?????

[gazza414]

I wonder how the graphs looked thru out the rev range? and not just peak power>  wish I had the resources to do this level of testing. Engine dyno the way to go.

great post

[DarkFalcon]

Great data and I applaud your effort. I will only make one point: camshaft selection and power optimization depends very heavily upon the flow characteristics of the head which is why the auto industry relies so heavily upon the high-end software which is available. It's the only means of evaluating the countless combinations that must be considered.

[whtrthanu]

I have one question, how do you flow one of my heads if  I never sold one to anyone on this site. The only people that have ANY of my heads are my close friends and repeat customers from the local area. IF this is who I think it might be than the head you are saying I ported is a stock head...I did your dad a favor by cleaning up the damage from shipping...There was no porting involved AT ALL......THats pretty sad that a stock head makes almost the same power as some of the porters out there.....You can tell now what you are really getting for your money. It is a very good post, just make sure you get your info correct before posting....................... I NEVER have sold any heads to anyone on this site.....I am curious to know why I am even on that list............

P.S. There are too many other variables in an engine combination to say who ports  the best head......You also have a variation in compression, not to make a big deal out of that but there probably is 3 or 4 hp in that alone, if one head has a few more cc's of port volume it will take advantage of that increased compression where the lower compression motor it would hurt.......

[DarkFalcon]

WHO IS SHARKEY?????

A guy in Indy that works with Robert Mason and others. From what I understand, a big proponent of low lift flow.

[busarug]

He is from indy and does some awesome work!

[SLEEPERBUSA]

VERY good post, as was already stated.
I know that Carpenter wants his cams set at 110/110, or higher. The 105/107 may not compliment his specific port design?
Thanks for the post. Add more info if/when you have time please.

[AIRTIME MOTORSPORTS]

VERY good post, as was already stated.
I know that Carpenter wants his cams set at 110/110, or higher. The 105/107 may not compliment his specific port design?
Thanks for the post. Add more info if/when you have time please.

YEA I WAS WONDER IF THEY EVEN NEW THEY WERE SETTING THEM UP WRONG???

[gazza414]

VERY good post, as was already stated.
I know that Carpenter wants his cams set at 110/110, or higher. The 105/107 may not compliment his specific port design?
Thanks for the post. Add more info if/when you have time please.

YEA I WAS WONDER IF THEY EVEN NEW THEY WERE SETTING THEM UP WRONG???

I'd suggest neither are right or wrong as we dont know what the Carpenter setup is at this point nor do we know for sure if John Smith went any further in optimising the setup for just peak power or area under the curve etc etc... we know a little from the above information and thats about it at this stage...dont draw to many conclusions.

[gnd111]

With reference to the Ward head - GeorgeC has one and his bike liked the lower cam setting better than the higher ones...

[$paz Racing]

This is all good but remember one think most engine builders have there own cam specs. I have tried the cams U use for testing and lost hp. I am not saying they bad they just don't work well with my heads. Also too set up is everything. Piston to head, vavle to piston. Price of the heads? We have made 228hp on stock valved heads with 1397's on MRXO1 @13.3.1 comp
Also remember a guy named Ray Bellucci that stop using flow benchs. I used them only when port designs are changed. I also feel some of the big shops copy others head designs. True hand porting is a dieing art. all just my 2 cents Spaz

[mike46]

Also remember a guy named Ray Bellucci that stop using flow benchs. I used them only when port designs are changed. I also feel some of the big shops copy others head designs. True hand porting is a dieing art. all just my 2 cents Spaz

There is some truth in that statement.

[$paz Racing]

I built two identical 1397s same pistons 13.1, cams pump gas etc ... one had my Spaz head on it and the other had a Ward head.The only differance one had a muzzypipe and  one had a yosh pipe. The bike with the yosh pipe and my head made 216 the other made 188 the customer called Ward and asked what could be up. Told ward this was a street bike. Ward told him he needed his cams. .445 lift cams. I thouhgt WTF those aren't street cams plus is would not have made up that much hp's. His bike runs good but not where it should be. I am not knocking Ward just showing not everything seems as it apears. LOTS of varables.
I also found bored throttle body lose power on 1397's.

[PerformancePorting]

Why not tell everyone who did this fine testing.

[whtrthanu]

Im still wondering how the hell my name is even on this list when I never did any head work for any one on this site...........
I can tell you this from my flow bench work, I have flow tested and dyno tested EVERY ones heads from Ward to V/H to Carpenter..... I can tell you why each one ports the way he ports and why some of them believe port speed is more important than port volume.
I would never say or put up a list of a one type motor combo and make some of these shops to be not good at what they do.... Any engine developer NOT AN ASSEMBLER will tell you that to make some ridiculous list of who makes the most power on one type of motor is plain stupid.....

Im pretty positive on who wrote the list and for you to come out with this list without even having ANY motorcycle engine developement under your belt is really a joke....

We always want to know who makes the most power, and I will ALWAYS say the same thing like any other professional would.................Lite the boards up and lets see the ET an MPH.............................................ENOUGH SAID>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[mike46]

I've done a thousand heads...at least. You will never get one to do exactly what you want....all the time. A good post but I'm not worried. People can search for the Holy Grail of heads all they want. Remember this...if 1 person made the best of ANYTHING no one would make a comparable product.

[DaveO]

Mike,

Wow...I had no idea you have worked on that many. Thats your prob....you see if you just started on them in the last year or so you WOULD be an expert...and know everything...LOL

Dave

[mike46]

Mike,

Wow...I had no idea you have worked on that many. Thats your prob....you see if you just started on them in the last year or so you WOULD be an expert...and know everything...LOL

Dave

  Thanks Dave. I really think guys in the know would agree...there are basic shapes you conform to and that involves floor flattening, divider thinning etc. It's been the same forever in bike porting and I'd challenge anybody to disagree. Sure, more volume for application but depending on cams, timing etc, etc....... Christ it hasn't changed much in regard to shape. I've got some interesting stories especially from bracket guys.

[Pinky]

not tryin to fight here but i heard the busa is different then the oldschool bikes
they flow good to start with i was also told you cut them different then most ??? if i remember right??
and the man that told me that is on this list of head guys and not near the bottom
and in my opinion hes real good at what he does
but like i said im not tryin to fight here

[SLEEPERBUSA]

I also found bored throttle body lose power on 1397's.

How about a 1430?

[DarkFalcon]

I really think guys in the know would agree...there are basic shapes you conform to and that involves floor flattening, divider thinning etc. It's been the same forever in bike porting and I'd challenge anybody to disagree. Sure, more volume for application but depending on cams, timing etc, etc....... Christ it hasn't changed much in regard to shape. I've got some interesting stories especially from bracket guys.

Mike, I highlighted a word you used only because it continues to come up in conversations with people who are paid serious money to to improve airflow and combustion efficiency. Other words include velocity, mixture quality and laminar/turbulent flow. I have had the opportunity to compare a number of the heads mentioned in the topic post and I would say for sake of conversation they can be divided into two schools: bulk CFM and velocity. I would place Ward in the CFM camp and Vance & Hines in the other; the small Ward head features minimum sectional areas that are 24% bigger than a stock valve Vance & Hines head. The head designed around velocity may or may not offer the same peak but it is likely to offer a broader power band and a better recovery to an abrupt change like, say, a shift in gears.

[mike46]

not tryin to fight here but i heard the busa is different then the oldschool bikes
they flow good to start with i was also told you cut them different then most ??? if i remember right??
and the man that told me that is on this list of head guys and not near the bottom
and in my opinion hes real good at what he does
but like i said im not tryin to fight here

Well, the ports are certainly different than early GS, KZ or CB750's Downdraft intakes pretty much look the same in regard to basic shape. Divider length, opening shape etc can be different for sure but the basic shape remains. I'm not saying the busa port isn't different from other ports but it isn't that different. As for cutting it....I'm sure the person your talking about does thin the divider, increase bowl diameter a bit, work on the port floor especially at the seat etc. As DarkFalcon said, the difference in most ported heads is in regard to bulk flow vs velocity and like I said earlier if one person had the absolute best head for all purposes he/she would be the only one porting heads.